Stampede
Denominations
The next morning Seth walked up to the breakfast table where Rick, Cruz, and Jovel were eating. “Hey guys. Do you have about an hour you can spare this morning?”
Rick wiped his mouth with a napkin. “What’s up Seth?”
“Jane has a video of Pastor Flynn’s appearance on Molony’s show. I’m going over to their trailer to watch it. She said I could bring a few people.”
Cruz stacked the empty plates, and put the silverware on top of them. “What’s it about?”
“She said something about the different denominations, and those are the people that will be coming here. I thought it would be a good brush up for us. You know, to understand what others are thinking or expecting.”
Jovel nodded. “That’s a good idea. We should get Trent to join us. He’s the one they get started with.”
Seth clapped his hands together. “Okay. I told Jane we’d come by about 10:00, so let’s meet here fifteen minutes early. I’ll go find Trent.”
*****
Jane put the tape in the VCR. “This was a couple of weeks ago. Make yourselves comfortable, and help yourselves to the tea and snacks on the counter.” She pressed play.
Cruz got up to get a snack, and Trent followed him for some tea. They both sat back down before the intro song was over.
Molony turned to the camera. “Good evening. Tonight we’re going to take a look at the American denominational church system. We will talk about the mainstream Christian religions tonight, and tomorrow night we’ll discuss other, fringe, or popular movements. There will be no commercials, and we are doing a simulcast. You can watch us on our network or the Chapel’s live feed. This is truly the biggest audience we’ve ever addressed, none the less…” Molony pointed to the camera. “Caution, you’ve entered The Molony Zone!
The camera pulled back. “Hopefully through a little spirited conversation we can give our audience a lot of good information to chew on?” Molony offered his hand across the table to shake.
“I look forward to it.” Pastor Flynn took his hand. “But I must warn you, I won’t talk about other persons by name. That’s a very dangerous thing to do.”
Molony contended. “I appreciate your position, but we’re not talking about Passover verses Easter! We have global changes taking place. The skies are doing things never recorded. It’s obvious we’re going through some kind of change. The world is on the edge of their seats. Every religion is projecting their vision, and that includes certain rogue nations strutting their ‘call to action’. It’s getting dangerous real quick.”
“I understand.”
Molony took a deep breath and shut his eyes. He closed his mouth and held it for a second, before blowing the air through his nose. “Pastor, we asked you here because of the way you handled yourself in the mix of the other religions. If I wanted someone to ignore my questions and spin everything back to the same old hell and damnation, don’t you think I would have asked Pastor Brees? I told you before; our ratings are not the issue. We want to know what’s going on, so please help us get a basic perspective while we look at America's situation.”
Pastor Flynn leaned forward a bit. “I think we can do that, and I don’t think we have to do any name calling, or drag anyone across the carpet. Their issues are addressed sufficiently in the Word.”
Molony checked his notes. “Let’s get started. Under the Christian banner we have several denominations, but they fall in three primary groups: Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, and Protestant.”
Pastor Flynn folded his hands together. “For the most part, yes.”
Molony smiled. “Great. In our first segment we’ll talk about my favorite; I’m a Roman Catholic. They, we, are the largest Christian denomination. There are more than a billion of us worldwide. Most Latin countries are Catholic, so is Spain, and of course, Italy. We believe the Apostle Peter is cited as the first pope, but the more modern understanding of Catholicism traces back to Constantine the Great.”
Pastor Flynn asked. “Does your church teach you the things written in Revelation?”
Molony shook his head. “I’ve studied the Bible several times, but we don’t read Revelation much. We view the book, which we call the Apocalypse, as one of the toughest books to understand. Like you mentioned when you explained the seals, trumps and vials, the symbolism is beyond fantastic.”
Pastor Flynn winked. “Every parable, metaphor, or colloquialism is fantastic imagery if taken out of context. But to the trained eye and in context it can be a crystal clear picture.”
Molony sat up a little straighter. “But Pastor Flynn, it’s a book written during the ‘apocalyptic’ time. There have been many arguments against its authenticity.”
“So there is no Armageddon? Did you ask me here because the skies are going through a routine cycle?”
“Of course not.” Molony pointed to his notes. “We believe the birth of a new age could happen next week, or in millions of years. That’s God’s business. In the olden days Armageddon was host to a lot of carnage, so it has become a… colloquialism as you say. We don’t view it as giving away any specific location. We would never do that in warfare, and this is a spiritual war.”
“Yes it is.” Pastor Flynn chuckled. “You know, Jesus doesn’t just pop up and say here I am. He returns in dramatic fashion, with two simultaneous battles. The one Christ leads is going to be in Israel, and I believe you will see the Father execute the other in Alaska. These are the battles of Armageddon and Hammengog. They are very real locations Mr. Molony. We can break down the verses if you like. Revelation is easy once you get in.”
Molony looked at the camera. “Now I know what it feels like to be a guest on The Molony Zone!”
The audience laughed.
Pastor Flynn picked up on the opportunity. “Since you’re in guest mode, what have you been taught about the antichrist?”
Molony smiled, adjusting himself to this new role. “Well, I know the word only appears in John’s works. I view it as symbolic. You know, a ghost in your past isn’t literal at all; it’s just a reference to something you would rather forget. We’re taught the antichrist is the collective forces of evil we contend with daily. Before we had you on our show I always thought it had nothing to do with any certain individual.”
Pastor Flynn winked. “Therein lies the danger of a denomination. I agree there are symbolic descriptions throughout the book, but that doesn’t mean we are not to understand them? If you use Daniel as an overlay to Revelation it stops you from wandering.”
“Wait a minute, slow down Pastor Flynn. Let’s keep it simple.”
“Okay. If God is everything good, and He was made manifest in the flesh… and if the battle is between good and evil? Then evil must be real, so evil would also be made manifest. Satan. And Satan did visit Jesus in the wilderness.” Pastor Flynn slid both hands to the center of the table. “He also hassled Job, and he told God that he had been ‘to and fro’ from the earth. Of course he is real.” Pastor Flynn made a fist and lightly hit the table as he spoke. “But he chose to be a fallen angel. He was not, and will not, ever be born into a human heritage.”
Molony leaned back. “How can you know that?”
Pastor Flynn opened his fist, and slid both hands back to the edge of the table. “The book of Jude. It’s only one chapter. It’s the last one before the book of Revelation.” He leaned back in his chair. “It gives you a description of the fallen angels, and their status. A person has to trust God to come in the flesh, to be born that is. We all had to make that choice. Satan and his fallen angels chose otherwise. That’s how we know he won’t be here as a human.”
“That’s it?”
Pastor Flynn shook his head. “No. Also because Christ told Satan to get behind Him, added with the fact he is now held in chains by Michael until he gets booted from heaven to come here. The seals were preserved for the people of the end time. So there is a time identified by the Bible where these things become known, or you could say ‘activated’. What we’re talking about today is part of the fifth seal, and we are in it.”
Molony flipped through his notes. “Well, if Daniel is an overlay, how about the beast having the feet of a bear?”
“The bear meant nothing to them, but to us we can see it is Russia of today.”
Molony retorted. “How could Daniel write about Russia?”
Pastor Flynn tapped on the table. “You’re making my point. It was written as a description of our time, not the geography of the world during their time.“
“Why Russia?”
“God uses whomever He pleases, but you have to know something about Russia… you have to go way back. God said Jacob I loved and Esau I hated. Get your staff to trace Russia’s history. Esau didn’t care about his heritage and Russia is from Esau. That’s why they are away from the fat of the land, but you watch, they are going to want Alaska back.”
Molony pointed off stage. “We’ll look into that, Pastor.”
“You can also point your experts to the good old United States in the great book of Isaiah.”
Molony held up his hand to stop Pastor Flynn. “Wait, what do you mean they will want Alaska back?”
“That’s where I feel the battle of Hammengog is going to take place, at the second coming. Everyone in America will see the skies light up as hailstones weighing a hundred eighty pounds scream through the sky, and smash into the people trying to get here. Sodom and Gomorrah set a pretty good example of what I’m describing.”
Molony shook his head. “Well, that’s pretty drastic. We don’t believe man can understand the second coming. There is so much symbolism that we can’t take it literally. We have to read it and trust it represents God coming back in glory, just as I learned as a kid. Let’s see… Jesus now lives with you in glory, but He is also on earth among us, and then something about, one day He will come in glory. Anyway, it’s been a long time.”
“Mr. Molony, if I just picked up and read Revelation because it’s at the end of the book and I wanted to see how the Bible ends, I might see it exactly as you describe. But there are over thirty points of relationship between Revelation and Genesis, and although Revelation has a little over four hundred verses, within them are hundreds of references to other scriptures, including the entire thirty second chapter of Deuteronomy. It is by these we can cross-reference to gain clarity and consistency.“
“I’m just fine with my studies, sir.” Molony looked down, adjusting his suit.
Pastor Flynn bit his lower lip. “No harm intended. I’ve seen your show enough to know you would never follow a religion blindly, and I trust you feel you have adequate support for your doctrine. I’m not here to change your mind; just answer your questions. Perhaps I should go back to being the guest?”
Molony smiled at the camera. “Good idea. Shall we move on?”
“Sure!” Pastor Flynn smiled.
Molony looked at the camera. “Let’s talk about Eastern Orthodox. This version of Christianity is most prominent in Russia and Greece. It was born as a result of disputes between Eastern and Western Christianity. Eastern Orthodox believers reject the supremacy of the Pope, they reject the literal translation of the scriptures, and they reject the rapture. Their end times are expressed through eschatology, which is a branch of theology regarding the final events of earth.”
Molony turned to Pastor Flynn. “How are they doing, Pastor?”
Pastor Flynn cleared his throat. “Well, they do believe Christ will physically return to the earth and judge mankind. They also believe before He can do that, there will be a great falling away, and the antichrist will be revealed. So until those two things happen I suppose they’ll keep their noses to the grindstone.”
Molony titled his head. “Would you call them safe?”
Pastor Flynn responded. “I wouldn’t say that. They believe there will be a tribulation before He comes, and both the good and the bad will participate. So they expect to be here. They expect to go through it.”
Molony asked. “What do you think?”
Pastor Flynn smiled. “Sure. That’s the hour of temptation, and during it we will see both the great falling away and an awakening. During that hour we will see the antichrist revealed. The differences in how they see those events, and how I see those events, are substantial. Since they expect to be here I’m confident there are many in their group that will sprout into the truth during that time. We read the scriptures differently today, but they are familiar with the basic tenets, and I feel many will come around.”
Molony circled on his paper. “So they don’t have anything to worry about?”
Pastor Flynn took a sip of water. “I can’t say that either. We’re looking for the remnant to wake up. Some will come from their group. The big toe in the door is they are firm in their stance against the rapture, so they‘re more prepared to stand against Satan’s tactics than many other churches. It’s going to be a spiritual temptation, and this will give them the option to question. Look, make no mistake about it, the churches are the target.”
Molony asked. “What is the Eastern Orthodoxy in danger of?”
Pastor Flynn leaned back and threw his hands up. “Whoa, partner. You’re getting me awfully close to judging, and you know I won’t go there. I can only comment based on the scriptures. From that perspective I would say my concern is they believe their final judgment is self-administered. In a way it sounds arguable, because judgment is based upon the actions of each person. God didn’t make us sin, so one could argue it is self-imposed.”
“Of course. We can’t blame God for what we do.”
“Exactly. The rewards and punishments however are administered by God, not man. He alone is the authority, and it is His judgment day.”
Molony shrugged his shoulders. “But the judgment is well after Christ returns. That means their biggest threat today is going along with the world during the hour of temptation?”
“Overall, I think they have enough information to turn their ship. You never know though? Satan’s hour isn’t called tempting for nothing.”
“Very good. Let’s move on.” Molony looked at the camera. “Our next major group of Christianity is the Protestant movement. They started when Martin Luther protested against the Roman Catholic Church during the Reformation. Protestants are not easily grouped like the others. This denomination covers a wide swath. Most of the differences can be seen by how close they hold to the formal traditions and liturgy of their Catholic roots. Some can be formal, others not at all.” Molony looked at Pastor Flynn. “Anything else?”
“I would sum up that the average Protestant believes ultimate authority resides in the scriptures, whereas the Eastern Orthodoxy believes the supreme authority belongs to the collective of their entire community, and Catholic’s give it to the Pope.”
“So they disagree on who is in charge? Anything else?”
Pastor Flynn nodded. “Protestants believe faith alone is sufficient for the believer.”
Molony asked. “You mean versus works, is it?”
“Well, I can only imagine what kind of works the malefactor on the cross beside Jesus had. Whatever they were, they got him on the cross. Yet in his dying words he confessed, and Jesus told him He would see him the same day in paradise.”
Molony rubbed his chin. “Ah, so does that mean works don’t count?”
“Not at all.” Pastor Flynn sat up. “Think of your works like a savings account. They weave the fine linen of your rewards in heaven. The problem is works without faith are dead. It’s a mutual relationship.”
“What do you mean?”
“On one hand, if you donate your time to a church for the recognition, you did it for the wrong reasons. Getting noticed is your reward. On the other hand, people with faith, but no works to show for it are not much better. They hide their light in the darkness. My experience has been that one who truly has faith will always have works. It can’t be helped. It’s like water coming from a spring, and it flows.”
Molony nodded his head. “Good point.”
Pastor Flynn added. “Some, like the malefactor, confess to God in their dying breath. They may have squeezed in the door at the last second, but inside is still inside. That is a key distinction in that Protestants believe in justification by grace, verses the other sanctification processes implied.”
Molony stopped him. “Can you clarify that?”
“The people who lived prior to Jesus were here during a time known as ‘The Law’. Now under Christ, we are in a period of ‘Grace’. The people before Christ couldn’t pray in Jesus’ name because He wasn’t here yet. I mean, when people pray to the Father, of course Jesus is included, but He had yet to come in the flesh. They were subject to Levitical law, whereas we can be cleansed of our sins through faith in Jesus Christ.”
“That sounds too simple… just believe?”
“The Law proved, over many generations, that man was not capable of keeping God’s will. Every man fell short. Christ climbed the mountain, and did so in accordance with the Law. He is the only one capable of knowing each person’s heart, and therefore He as a just judge is capable of redeeming those that want to be in the family. It’s not a matter of how you sinned. It’s a matter of knowing you sinned, and having a change of heart to be a better person.”
“There has to be more to it than just saying I’m sorry?”
Pastor Flynn sipped his water. “Well, let me put it this way… any teenager can make a baby, and therefore be a dad, but any successful grandparent knows the birth is only the starting point. How that teenager continues to parent makes all the difference in the world when it comes to their family life and their children’s opportunities.”
Molony grinned. “I see, so a person’s works is how they parent their faith… I like that.”
“Don’t get me wrong, liturgy has its place, but it has also become pageantry. When Christ rent the veil from top to bottom, He did away with the ordinances that placed another man between Him and His children. You can look at the recent scandals in the church, and even see men who dedicate their life to God are capable of despicable things. Everyone is.”
Molony marked his notes. “Do you agree with the Protestant view regarding the priesthood of all believers?”
Pastor Flynn paused. “If you are asking if I believe every soul has a direct relationship with the Father, and has the ability to take their problems directly to Him even if it’s only in their heart? Yes. There is no authority people need to go through. There is no man who can hear your confession and tell you by repeating prayers and counting beads it will make things okay. Prayer is not a punishment, or a recital. It’s our direct exchange with the Father, who will answer you while you’re in study. He only needs to hear your heart honestly expressing what it feels. Once is enough. If the repentance is there He will know it. You’re crazy if you think God wants to see you write the same sentence on the blackboard a thousand times.”
Molony squirmed a bit in his chair. “I can see your point, even though I’ve counted a lot of beads. Let’s move on. Do you agree with Protestant views of the scriptures being the ultimate authority?” Molony turned to the camera. “Verses Catholicism which has a liturgical hierarchy, or Orthodoxy where the church as a whole has authority.”
Pastor Flynn leaned forward on his forearms and folded his hands. “Well, I’ll keep this simple. Jesus told us the Bible contains all that we need to know, so if you have it in context you would be in accordance with God’s authority… as expressed in the scriptures. But here’s a little caveat, in the first chapter of John it says in the beginning was the Word. It says the Word was with God, and the Word was God. It also says Christ is the Living Word. There is but one Authority, one. He has many ways to help ensure the body of the church acts accordingly, but if you grant the actual authority to the scriptures, you require a person, a teacher, a priest, or a pastor to help you learn the word, and that opens the door for a man to get between you and God. That is exactly how Satan was able to twist scriptures and cultivate his plan.”
“Plan?”
“The so-called rapture. He’s twisting scriptures to influence how people interpret things. The Bible is accurate, but God reveals certain meanings to those He seals.”
“I see.”
“Look. All the different denominations can’t be right, so if the teacher is wrong, how much more the student? We all need teachers, but if they themselves struggle with accurate discernment, how can you enforce that authority? We’re talking about the same words being read differently.”
Molony pursed his lips a bit. “Hmmm?”
Pastor Flynn leaned forward. “The answer is that you go to God for clarification. It’s His word. He authored it. And He lived it.” He leaned back in his chair. “Just because someone said the Bible, or God, told them something doesn’t make it true.”
“For instance?”
“Here, I’ll give you one more quick example. The word tells us how to anoint for healing. We know we are to have a little vial of pure olive oil. We pray for God to bless it. Now, I’m telling you that any Christian, any with the spiritual muscle to get it done, can dab a little oil on their fingertip and anoint whatever needs anointing. It could be the doorposts of a house, or the forehead of a fellow believer. The Word didn’t bless the oil, or heal, and we surely didn’t do it. God does the healing, not the guy holding the oil. We go through the process to show obedience, and to demonstrate we are familiar with what God would have us do. Yet how many people do you see on TV claiming to heal people by blowing on them, or pushing them over, or even simply laying hands on them? If we don’t read the instructions, then how can we know when someone is pulling the wool over our eyes?”
Molony nodded as he wrote on his notes. He paused a second, and tapped his pen on the paper. “You said those with spiritual muscle? Why do they need anything if God does it all?”
Pastor Flynn raised his eyebrows. “Have you ever seen a real demon? I’d wager you’re mind is not equipped for such encounters.”
“No.”
“You would soil your pants. I don’t care how big you are. They don’t either, and they have lots of friends. You can’t take these things lightly Mr. Molony. Let me ask you this, has your hair ever stood up on your neck?”
“Sure. Everyone has experienced that.”
“Could you make it go back down?”
“No.”
Pastor Flynn turned his hands palms up and shrugged his shoulders. “Exactly! That level of intuition is a whole new level. If you’re not ready, they’ll take you apart. Do you think it’s the white collar that makes a devil leave? Heck no. The collar is present in Hollywood because it tells the audience which person has biblical authority. Hollywood uses this as an icon to do that. Obviously I view the white-collar crowd as a denomination, or I would be wearing one.”
“Very good. Let’s get back to the end times.”
“Sure. The bottom line is we all leverage the word, and we all are trying to hold ourselves accountable to the word, because the word never changes. It’s man’s handling of the scriptures that have us sitting here today addressing differences. And I think it is man’s interpretation that has the world confused about what is happening.”
Molony shuffled his notes. “How do the Protestants interpret what is going to happen?”
“Well they differ amongst themselves quite a bit. I know of some who think we will go to heaven, some think heaven will be experienced here at a much later time, and some think heaven could be within reach as we are, right here, right now.”
Molony marked on his notes. “Why do you think there is so much diversity?”
Pastor Flynn explained. “Let’s just say Calvin’s works had a tremendous impact on them. From what I understand the book of Revelation was the only New Testament book he did ‘not’ write a commentary on. It’s no wonder the topics within it are out of his student’s reach. Revelation does a great job of locking in the scriptures, but they differed enough on them to go to separate churches. It’s sad.”
“What about pre-millennialism? Does it tie into our skies?”
“Again.” Pastor Flynn cleared his throat. “This traces back to differences of opinion on the book of Revelation. The pre-millennialists believe at the end of our age there will be a thousand year reign of Christ. Then at the end of that time they will be raptured away. Those left behind will have to face the antichrist.”
Molony tapped his pen on the table. “What say you?”
Pastor Flynn responded. “I understand where they are pulling their scriptures from, and how they are using them to reach their conclusions…”
“But…” Molony leaned forward.
Pastor Flynn shrugged his shoulders. “But even if some of them have graduated from the rapture theory, their concept of Christ’s reign before the antichrist has them in a very dangerous position.”
“Why so?”
Pastor Flynn tapped the table. “Because the antichrist comes at the sixth trump, and Christ returns at the seventh. They will be susceptible to believing Satan is Jesus coming back to reign. It’s written he convinces the world he is God, and I’m sure this is part of that. The pre-millennialists will be easy and willing prey.”
Molony raised his eyebrows. “Wow, Pastor. You see some of the Protestants with pretty big hurdles?”
“We all have hurdles. I told you they covered a wide swath. A lot of it is good. Some is dangerous. Protestants have been a very public group and have helped a lot of people. There will always be disputes over doctrine, and I am sure they dispute some of my doctrine, but I trust our Father will reach those He calls from them, when it’s their time.”
Molony tucked his chin. “When is their time? Isn’t it time now?”
Pastor Flynn shook his head. “I’m talking about the people who get called from within their group during the hour of temptation. It will be a time when people have to testify to their beliefs. Some will fall in line, others will speak the Pentecostal tongue of Acts, chapter two. That will wake up millions of souls.”
Molony looked at the camera. “You’re setting up quite a scenario, Pastor.”
Pastor Flynn replied. “I didn’t set it up. I’m explaining it. It’s always been there, Mr. Molony.”
Molony turned to a new page in his notes. “Let’s run down a few Protestant denominations. We’ll start with the Amish. These are the Christians who avoid the progress of modern man, and they reject most technology. Some of their horse drawn carriages use oil to illuminate the lights even to this day. They trace back to Switzerland, where they split from the Protestant church during the sixteen hundreds. They disagreed over issues like the rejection of the ‘all church’ authority, and infant baptism. They started coming to America, predominately through Pennsylvania during the eighteenth century. There are now more than two hundred Amish settlements around the United States.”
Pastor Flynn took a deep breath, and tilted his head for a second. “We don’t hear much from the Amish people. They’re more reserved compared to the typical outgoing Christian. They strive to stay in control of their human nature.”
Molony clarified. “You mean actions based on pride or arrogance are not tolerated, and values like humility and family are earnestly strived for?”
Pastor Flynn nodded. “As a result they have very closely knit communities, up through adolescence, and on to marriage. It’s all carefully monitored. They have a code of behavior enforced by their local bishop. His power covers everything regarding daily life and their customs.”
Molony circled on his notes. “So it seems to me there could be some brainwashing under such controlled circumstances? What say you Pastor Flynn?”
Pastor Flynn leaned back. “I wouldn’t go that far, not at all. Every denomination has rules and regulations to separate them from the others. If a teenage boy is riding in the back of a buggy, and he sees another boy pass him in a convertible Corvette with his girlfriend, that doesn’t mean the boy in the buggy is missing anything. In fact the boy in the Corvette very well could ‘drive’ right through life missing everything because his mind was allowed to pursue happiness without any guidance, structure, or support?”
Molony smiled and added. “Life definitely has distractions.”
Pastor Flynn said. “In retrospect it seems like Amish life could be a safer, or at least a more innocent life for a child growing up. However, I would like to see them get a little bit more into the spirit of life. By this I mean when they play a simple game like volleyball, it’s okay to have fun, but not to compete? I just think there is quite a bit to gain from some of the elements of life they abstain from. Plus as an ex military person myself, I feel it’s important for all Americans to serve their country… not only their community.”
Molony offered. “Some are modernized, Pastor. Some Mennonites have a very secular lifestyle.”
Pastor Flynn held his palms up and shrugged his shoulders. “As you can see, America has every blend of religion.”
Molony looked at the camera. “Another Christian denomination is Baptist. It was founded around sixteen hundred, in England. About twenty-five years later it reached Rhode Island. They encourage religious freedom, and strive for separation of church and state. They are about thirty-one million strong, and as implied by the name, they believe in baptism by total immersion, which is done as an adult.”
Pastor Flynn held up three fingers. “They are split in their end time views. Some think there will be a ‘Pre-Tribulation’ rapture, some a mid-trib, and others a post-trib.” He grabbed his first finger. “Obviously the pre-tribs are in more danger, but there’s plenty of danger to go around.”
“What about full immersion baptism as an adult?” Molony asked.
“That’s easy.” Pastor Flynn tapped on the table with his forefinger. “Christ set the example with John. We should follow that. We do it as adults because it is a decision that is to be made by a mature mind. Children are incapable of such reasoning. They should be dedicated, not baptized.”
Molony marked a check on his notes. “Let’s touch base on the Lutherans. They reject any type of millennialism. They believe they will be on earth to the very end, which supposedly won’t happen until a thousand years after Jesus returns. They get their name from Martin Luther, who was excommunicated from the Roman Catholic Church for his beliefs.”
Pastor Flynn smiled. “One of my students calls them Catholic Light, or Diet Catholicism.”
Molony’s grinned. “I haven’t heard those names. Go on…”
Pastor Flynn continued. “First, I must say Lutherans hold the scriptures as sufficient for all Christian doctrine. So they have the tools ‘if’ they want to work with them. But there are areas that rub me the wrong way.”
“Such as?” Molony asked.
“Well.” Pastor Flynn folded his hands together, and placed them in his lap. “There’s a little issue with baptism being the time one is given salvation. There’s the concept of the Holy Communion being literal… and I must say any organization elevating people like Mary, or the Pope, to a level beyond what we all are, is in my opinion, falling short.”
“That’s a mouthful, Pastor.” Molony backtracked. “What’s this about salvation at the time of baptism?”
“Yes sir. I teach that baptism is a choice to be made by each individual, but in the end it is a ritual. We should do it, but if you don’t it won’t stop Jesus from saving you.”
“Like the malefactor on the cross.”
“Yes, or any child. Children are covered under grace prior to the age of accountability. An aborted fetus didn’t really have much time to sin, or repent now, did it?”
“Some liberals will contest a fetus isn’t human yet.”
“Okay, let’s simplify. What if a teenager watches Jesus of Nazareth on Saturday night. The next morning he wakes, and grabs his dad in excitement, ‘Dad! Dad! Let’s go to church! I understand now. I believe it. I get it. I want to be a Christian. Last night I prayed for half an hour. I asked the Lord to be in my heart. I understand and will set my feet in Christ’s direction! It was so warm. I got tingles that wouldn’t go away. I cried… I’m ready, dad.’ But on the way to the church there is a terrible accident. Both the father and son are killed instantly. Are you telling me that because the dad was baptized he will be in heaven, but the son missed out on salvation?”
Molony responded. “That might be a little problem.”
Pastor Flynn added. “Specially if the father quit going to church more than twenty years ago, and didn’t want anything to do with his church.”
Pastor Flynn added. “Specially if the father quit going to church more than twenty years ago, and didn’t want anything to do with his church.”
“I wouldn’t say that, otherwise Christ wouldn’t have done it. Remember the oil and the healing. We are to follow our examples.” Pastor Flynn rubbed the tip of his thumb and forefinger together. “But using the ordinance to activate salvation puts a man between the person being saved and God. That is a vulnerability to corruption, and can even lead to other bad doctrine.”
Molony kept plowing. “With the few moments we have left, I’d like to mention the Presbyterians. Many say these are the lukewarm Christians, because they aren’t over anxious about what’s happening.
“Some might take offense to lukewarm, you might say ‘slow and steady wins the race’, or something like that?” Pastor Flynn smiled. “But they are preparing for end times.”
“They also dwell in eschatology, which has four major events they look to…”
Pastor Flynn held his finger up. “Don’t forget they have internal conflicts regarding the timing of them.”
“Right.” Molony read from his notes. “My sources say they agree we will see the second coming of Christ, which will usher in a thousand year period called the Millennium. They anticipate a seven-year period when the antichrist will rule, being both a religious and political leader. The Antichrist will provoke the war of Armageddon, which results in the deaths of most humans, and that will make God pour out His wrath.” Molony looked at Pastor Flynn. “How did I do?”
“Don’t forget at some point during all this, they believe Jesus will descend from the skies to rapture away all His born again believers.”
Molony stacked his notes, and set them to the side. “It’s amazing. The differences between the faiths we discussed tonight are subtle, but they all seem to indicate something is on our horizon.”
Pastor Flynn smiled. “A lot of Christians have similar beliefs, or spin-offs of them. I think we’ve covered a lot of information for many of them to work with.”
Molony reached out to shake hands. “Well this sure has been an enlightening evening Pastor. I can’t thank you enough for stepping up. I’m sure a lot of us have many new questions as a result of the information you shared with us tonight, and I look forward to our next meeting.”
Pastor Flynn shook Molony’s hand. “Thank you. I apologize for not throwing the heavy punches you may have hoped for, but I truly love my brothers and sisters in the Lord. We all come out of confusion from somewhere, from everywhere. Myself included. Nobody knows everything, so we should do our best to remember that as we study our Father’s word. The key is to study and seek wisdom, and not to let any group or man control our pursuit.”